Correspondence between "Alice" and I BEFORE the crash of 2008

Correspondence between "Alice" and I BEFORE the crash of 2008
by Arachne on Thursday, September 16, 2008 at 8:01pm

FROM ME TO ALICE:  Just out of curiosity, you too see a stock market crash in the near future don't you? In your eyes, do you see it as worse than that of '29? I do.  ~ Maggie   *    Sep 16, 2008 6:08pm

 FROM ALICE TO ME:  I think there's going to be hell to pay, yes, and I'm sure I'm not the only one who sees a 'crash' coming. It will be interesting this time around as most of the mfg that was once done in the US has been outsourced, including raw materials (How much steel does the US make these days?) The fact that the World's money system is so interwoven could either compound the severity of whatever 'depression' comes about or could, in fact, soften the effect. One thing is for certain, however, that America will not come out on 'top' this time. Our government and our corporations owe too many foreign banks too much money. When "someone" forecloses on the Federal Reserve it is not going to be pleasant. What is not being bandied about right now is the fact that China cannot continue to 'grow'; problems with the US are going to tear into that economy and the dominoes will likely fall from there. The only really 'mature' gov't that will be able to take advantage of a world depression will probably be Russia. Their military is not over-extended; they have strong alliances with many countries that we have pissed off; their banks own a lot of portfolios that originated in the USA. If the American middle and lower classes are going to be able to save themselves through this, we all need to come together as small, sustainable groups and carry each other through. And I certainly don't mean religious groups, though there will be those, no doubt. We need to be able to grow food, purify water, build a power grid and create renewable energy, get rid of garbage and sewage - all the things that gov't does for us now that they won't be able to do when they are bankrupt. Kinda makes good, old-fashioned 'Communism' look pretty appealing right about now, doesn't it?    *          Sep 16, 2008 6:33pm

FROM ME TO ALICE: Thank you for your response as it is greatly appreciated.
Anyone who knows a tad of history or economics will see it. Then again, who are those people? Are we talking about those who are plugged in or those who have unplugged? As you know, manufacturing has moved because labor is cheap aborad. Also, it also fuels fire within Americans who believe that foreigners have stolen American jobs which is really not the case, but it does cause division of American against American of that race. The corporations are greedy that is why they have moved for cheap labor. As for the state of the United States, it has become a service industry and that is about it. We don't produce, we just consume.

This is what I see coming. Companies are going to bottom out due to various reasons and the dollar value will drop (as it has been). Loans will be called in from the top to the bottom which means that all will suffer. The middle class and some of the upper class are going to lose their shorts. Chances are the poor are not indebted to the creditors, however, will they have a job or will a welfare system be able to support those without means? Also, what about the value of money held in bank accounts? It is just numbers and NOT cash. Will ALL of it be available to the depositors? The answer is NO.

The corporations that are able to maintain themselves will buy up the devalued stock, take over the company(ies) and release a majority of the employees. In order to feed themselves, people will revert to theft (providing someone is producing and selling food). There will be an increase in crime be it violent or otherwise.

Russia...interesting that you should bring Russia up. They do have natural resources, but they too are in a capitalist state. Where has America not touched? As for China goes, their elite have rather large investments in the United States as do other countries. The Fed could print more bucks, but what would the value be? Would one need a wheelbarrow of cash to buy a loaf of bread?

Actually, what would be ideal is a state of anarchy, but not one of chaos. Anarchy is not chaos unless you are a fanatic and then it is a gap for another form of dictatorship. A self-reliant global tribal system of united humans would be ideal, but I am then talking about utopia. In utopia, people help each other. There is no police, no military, no war, no hunger. Do you believe me to be an idealist?   ~ Maggie     *      Sep 17, 2008 2:57pm

FROM ALICE TO ME:  Idealism has flowed through my veins for as long as I can remember; I've long believed that a 'revolution' of sorts will be the only way back out of the pit. And you are correct: Anarchy does not have to be chaos. I do believe, however, that some sort of 'government' is necessary, at least guidelines that people have to follow. Americans have too long been told that they are 'free to do whatever ...' which is simply not true. This is the part of Ron Paul's message that I cannot stomach. Most people have common sense and can develop a sense of common good, but there are many who are already too tribal, too self-centered, too religion-centric to be able to live in a true Libertarian society. Those people will always pray on those whom they consider to be depraved unbelievers, and there will always be enmity between groups because of this.

I think this is why I am so intrigued by Barack Obama. He's not the Messiah, certainly - that is a ludicrous statement. But he does have a very pragmatic, mature and idealistic vision of what America could be if we all grew up and cooperated with each other. Respect for all other people is a large part of his message, and I do not believe that the religionists can let go of their delusions and show respect for any but 'their own'.

It may be that this Nation needs to be divided somehow, where those of one particular slant can govern themselves without interference from the "other side". I think that is possible, except for the money-mongers and their minion (the lobbyists) who would fight tooth and nail to prevent a peaceful settlement of ideals. Sadly, in so-called conservative America, it has become something of an "all-or-nothing" mindset, and as a group these people seem willing to destroy the 'whole' rather than co-exist. A lot of their fanaticism is driven and fired by the MSM (who are owned by conservatives) and by Wall Street - also owned by the conservative lobby.     *      Sep 17, 2008 4:22pm